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Stargate Interview: Amanda Tapping, Brad Wright, & Google'due south Laurence Moroney talk Stargate AI ii.0
Sci-fi is full of cautionary tales about artificial intelligence, machines ascent up to make us obsolete, and, if we're specially unlucky, wipe us out. But what does the cutting edge of AI technology actually look similar today? Well, it might daze you lot to learn that it'southward busy learning how to write scripts for new Stargate episodes.
Enter Stargate AI, the ambitious project being headed upward by Stargate Telly serial co-creator Brad Wright and Google AI's Laurence Moroney in partnership with The Companion. The idea was simple – feed all the existing Stargate scripts into an AI and get it to write a new set of scripts for the actors to read. As information technology turns out, things are a lot more complicated than that.
The beginning Stargate AI project culminated last year with a alive reading from Amanda Borer (Samantha Carter), Michael Shanks (Daniel Jackson), Gem Staite (Jennifer Keller), and David Hewlett (Rodney Mckay) who all reprised their roles from Stargate SG-1 and Atlantis . It was a wild ride, and while the AI occasionally offered some surprises, it's prophylactic to say that it wasn't going to be replacing Brad Wright and his team anytime presently.
Now they're at it again to celebrate the 25th anniversary of Stargate SG-1, and this time Laurence and his team have made a few tweaks to the AI, with staggering results. For this second script reading, Amanda Tapping and Michael Shanks are back along with Richard Dean Anderson, stepping dorsum into the roles of Samantha Carter, Daniel Jackson, and Jack O'Neill together again for the beginning time in 12 years.
We had the gamble to chat with Amanda Tapping, Brad Wright, and Laurence Moroney nigh the Stargate AI projection, life later on Stargate, the history of the show, and the possible return of the beloved sci-fi franchise.
Before nosotros get into the interview, if you want to check out the Stargate AI two.0 Reunion Table Read, head on over to The Companion where you can sign upward for a free 3-month trial. The Stargate AI 2.0 effect debuts on May 21st at 11am PDT, 2pm EDT, 7pm BST. If yous can't make it for the debut stream though, don't worry as y'all can picket the whole thing at any time with your membership to The Companion.
We've also got an exclusive clip for Space.com readers to show you lot what y'all can expect to run into during the live read.
Space.com: Could you only tell our readers a little scrap about what the Stargate AI project is and what you lot're doing?
Laurence Moroney: Sure, I would love to hear Amanda's take on it.
Amanda Tapping: Well, Laurence is this crazy guy who works at Google and created an AI and fed all of the Stargate scripts into it, to see what it would come upward with. And it came up with its first iteration of scripts, which were really fun, simply a bit weird and slightly disjointed. In that location were words that weren't actually role of our language!
Then nosotros did a second round where the scripts were so much more than sophisticated [...] information technology got the dash of the characters in a much different way than the first iteration. Maybe because we had Richard Dean Anderson for the 2d iteration, and he's a very specific grapheme.
Brad was quite nervous as to whether this would mean writers were out of a job. They don't think that's the case quite yet... but the second iteration was a little frightening in that regard.
Laurence: [Amanda] pretty much hitting the smash on the head. [...] Brad was putting out the ideas. Okay, we've got over 300 episodes of Stargate and that's a lot of data. When people build AI they'd like to train it on information, and maybe we have enough information to be able to generate a script.
I don't actually like to use the term an AI as a noun. To me AI is a concept [...] But he [Brad] kind of put out that claiming and I responded. I had worked with Brad earlier on ane of his shows called Stargate Universe doing some digital marketing. It must be like 12-13 years ago. So fortunately, when I answered the challenge, Brad kinda sorta remembered me.
Brad Wright: I've been working with The Companion for a couple of years now, writing essays, doing podcasts, mostly with the diverse casts of Stargate. Great guys, going places I recollect. They suggested we practice a read through of a Stargate script – an idea for a scene or scenes that we never produced. There were two obstacles to that. One, if we had a good idea we shot it! Two, MGM owns Stargate, not me. I couldn't actually do anything without their permission.
Just then I had the thought: what if we got an AI to write the scenes equally a sort of scientific discipline experiment? Stargate SG-1 ran x seasons. That's a lot of material for an AI to draw from. So we put information technology out there on Twitter: Could an AI write scenes for Stargate? Laurence, whom I had met a decade earlier when he worked at Microsoft, immediately accepted the challenge. And every bit lead advocate for Google AI he'southward immensely qualified. It was a great excuse to get some of the band back together and do a read through of a script. It didn't take to exist adept, really. And it wasn't. Simply it ended up being very funny.
Laurence: I wanted to exercise it in a very different way. Frequently what happens is you'll feed a bunch of text into a model, y'all'll railroad train the model on that text, and you'll accept the model generate new text and it very speedily turns into gibberish.
The first tabular array read had Amanda, Michael Shanks, David Hewlett, and Gem Staite. Those four actors and actresses, and the characters that they play, had never appeared together in a scene. Right off the bat, y'all're behind the viii brawl. At that place's no existing scene with those folks in it. And then, for an AI to try and generate something with those four folks in information technology, at that place was nothing data. If nosotros try to do the same old way that everybody does it, and throw all of these into a model and have the model spit stuff out, information technology's going to be nonsense. I tried… and it was nonsense very rapidly.
And if you throw all the scripts at it and ask it to generate something, information technology will start generating stuff with characters for whom we didn't have the actors or actresses available. Again, yous'll striking a wall. And then I came upwards with a new way or a different fashion of doing this and instead of creating one model, I created individual models for each character.
Brad: I knew that AI wasn't actually there yet when Laurence accepted the challenge the kickoff time, and the results were hilarious. But, as he warned, AI written scripts tend to devolve into gibberish.
When The Companion suggested we try over again, Laurence accepted the challenge to make substantial improvements and, male child, did he evangelize. This time the scenes are cogent from beginning to end. Are they great writing? Maybe non. Just Laurence came up with truly innovative ways of improving his models. Jack sounded like Jack. Daniel was Daniel, etc. And the action description was far more realistic. I kept thinking, where did that come from?
I'm hoping this version gets some attention in the actual science world for its innovation. All credit to Laurence.
Laurence: What I wanted to focus on initially was the dialogue. And so, in this case, on folio dialogue will happen in response to iii different things. Number one, there would be action and there'll be dialogue in response to that. For instance, something explodes – how would Sam respond to that? She might say "accept encompass" or that kind of thing. Other people might become "ah, crap," merely she'd be more logical and her dialogue will generally exist different in response to activity.
The second thing would so be in response to something that somebody else has said, like how Sam would answer to Jack, or how Sam would respond to one of the bad guys. She would have a very item vernacular in responding to exterior dialogue.
And then the third thing would be, and this one's a footling fleck more vague, merely it's how Sam would respond to her ain dialogue. Say yous accept an action description and then in that location'll be the first thing that Sam would only say in response to that, but then the second thing she would say is generally following the offset thing that she said.
Most of the characters had those three models created for them. We had iv characters in the initial tabular array read – that's 12 models. In some cases I created additional ones. Like, the fans beloved Sam and Jack'south human relationship so I wanted to build something for how she responded to Jack in detail, or how Jack would respond to Sam.
Amanda: What I establish fascinating was the nuance that it picked up on. Information technology found Jack's sarcasm and all these little hooks that we had into our characters. It was almost similar it knew us. But then there were as well things similar at Jack's cabin. Daniel comes downwards the stairs in a bathrobe and I'm like "what the hell is Daniel doing in Jack's cabin?!" At that place'due south always been this sort of amour between the two of their characters in a weird and wonderful way that's never played up on in the testify [...] there's this interesting connection between the two of them. And in the AI script it was similar, "Well, what'due south just gone on hither fellas? I'one thousand the one that'due south supposed to be coming down the stairs in a bathrobe."
Laurence: And then at the terminate of that script, Jack gives Daniel a pay raise. Exactly. It was Rick [Richard Dean Anderson] that picked upwardly on that. Oh, that's why he was in the robe.
O'Neill, with two Ls
Infinite.com: As yous've mentioned, Richard Dean Anderson (Rick), who plays Jack O'Neill, is coming back for this 1, alongside Michael Shanks. How was it reuniting with the bandage?
Amanda: I talk to Rick all the time. And Michael. This pandemic has kept us all separate physically from each other, but I didn't feel like "Oh, I haven't seen them in then long. It'southward gonna be weird" because we're friends. But information technology was the get-go time hearing the three of us exercise these characters together again. I didn't realize how thrilled I would be past that, simply listening to Rick and Michael's banter [...] took me correct back to Stargate and to filming.
As soon as Rick started speaking as O'Neill, I was like, "oh, we're back." It took no time at all to driblet right into those characters again, like nix. That's a credit to Laurence in what he'south done.
Brad: Yes! The original band members. Richard had done a couple of The Companion events with me, including an Ask Me Anything, and so when I suggested he join us for some other try at a read through of AI written scripts he was happy to join in. It was squeamish seeing him, Amanda, and Michael on screen over again, even if it was in a Zoom call. Their affection for each other, fifty-fifty after all these years, shines through.
Space.com: Richard Dean Anderson is back for this one. Do you lot think he's gonna bring a different energy to the reading compared to the first one?
Brad: Rick was all in. He read every word the AI wrote and information technology was like Jack O'Neill had returned. I loved information technology. We all did.
Amanda: Aye [laughs]. I admire this man, simply absolutely love him. He is naughty and sarcastic and super intelligent. And then therefore really quick witted. He loves to play this bumbling fool, which he is decidedly not, but he plays information technology so well that you're convinced that he is. He brought a whole different energy, and I missed that. It was really fun to see him come back.
Laurence: Nosotros also brought a surprise element in this reading where nosotros did some AI generated fine art alongside it – Richard'southward reaction to them was absolutely priceless.
Amanda: Laurence did art in real fourth dimension. He plugged something in and we watched it. I don't know who said it, but information technology did wait like a Boston album embrace. The fine art was amazing.
Laurence: When y'all lookout man the stream, I hope nosotros catch a lot of Rick'due south reactions [...]
Amanda: Oh, yeah. But remembering.
Laurence: You know, the one I mean,
Amanda: Now I practice. I'one thousand blushing.
Infinite.com: Well now we can't wait to come across what you lot're talking nigh.
Amanda: It'll be very clear. There'll be no mistaking what we're laughing virtually.
Laurence: We were emceed past Marc Evan Jackson.
Amanda: I'm a massive fan of his and I love his work, particularly on Brooklyn Nine-9. When I beginning saw him, I was so starstruck. I was really nervous, merely it turns out he was a massive Stargate fan – information technology was just very cute. He had a character on this one. What was it, Jamaev?
Laurence: Jamaev, yeah. One of the scripts just kept having a man coming into the script as an antagonist doing obscure things, and I'm like, "Okay, we tin can't have it just chosen man in the scripts." This was i function where I manually did something. I just wanted to give him a Stargate-y sounding proper name, so I chosen him Jamaev, which is Marc Evan Jackson, correct? The first two messages of each of his names, and, you lot know, to encounter who would spot it first. And Brad got it correct away.
One of Rick's reactions to the art had us all laughing and then we couldn't continue. He [Marc] was the one being the perfect MC just brought information technology all back and just said "side by side on Stargate later dark." It was perfect.
Nada but proficient vibes
Space.com: Doing the AI read, did yous discover that you missed the character more than than you lot possibly thought you lot did?
Amanda: I did, because later Sam I went on to play Helen Magnus [Sanctuary], who was similar a completely unlike character. Sam is, afterward 10 years and a couple of movies, and then much a part of me. We informed each other so much. I've often said in interviews that I experience like I came into my own as a adult female while I was playing Sam and I call up Sam came into her ain every bit a woman at the same time. She'southward so much a part of me, but I realized the things virtually her that I missed, part of which is her logic, her loyalty, her integrity. So yeah, I'd missed playing her and information technology was nice to put the boots back on. Which I have a pair of.
Space.com: SG-1 ran for ten seasons and that's a long time for any show to run. What practise you recall it was well-nigh the testify that gave information technology that longevity and popularity with the fans?
Amanda: I recollect it was the correct fourth dimension for a bit of slightly optimistic sci-fi. And I call back it was the fact that there was a humour to the show. Nosotros took it seriously, only in that location was also a big sense of humor component, largely driven by Rick. Nosotros were really dissimilar characters, but all really fallible. I'd similar to call up that that makes it more accessible when you see a bit of yourself in the characters that you're watching on television. We didn't try to hibernate those flaws, we weren't superheroes. We weren't coming in like a lot of space shows were like "nosotros're coming to save the day." We screwed upwardly a lot, and and then acknowledged our mistakes. I liked that, it was very human.
The thing that I hear from a lot of fans, even to this day, is that they but loved watching the characters. A lot of women actually related to Sam and found a source of strength in her, or constitute an opportunity to pursue something that perhaps they didn't think they could have prior to watching the bear witness, which is phenomenal to me. And it was also a family safe show. I get and then many fathers and daughters coming upwards to me proverb that they watched the prove together and bonded over information technology. [Laurence raises his hand] Aye, like Laurence.
Brad: Stargate'due south secret sauce was that information technology was gear up in the present-day. Information technology could be happening correct now. The teams that went through the gate were like us, warts and all. The Stargate device itself gave us access to the galaxy we had not yet earned on our own. We eventually gained access to technology centuries more advanced, simply until so we were the underdog. When our squad won battles with our enemies, it was with our present-day engineering science, grit, and a lot of humor.
Space.com: The character of Sam definitely had a big affect on many sci-fi fans, ourselves included. Amanda, yous've caused the well-deserved moniker of the queen of sci-fi. Was sci-fi a natural fit for you when you started acting?
Amanda: It was non a natural fit for me, it wasn't. I liked Star Trek: The Adjacent Generation – I watched that with my brothers – but I was more [of a] Lilliputian House on the Prairie kind of girl. Then when I get-go started I vowed I would never do television, because I wouldn't prostitute myself for my art. You lot know, do art films mayhap if they were in black and white. I had very lofty ideals of but doing the Stratford Festival and things similar that, but so goggle box became a really natural fit. Stargate was interesting because I watched the movie, merely I didn't know a lot about sci-fi and I retrieve that that actually helped me in some ways. I didn't come in with any preconceived notions of what sci-fi was supposed to be.
Space.com: Is in that location a particular highlight of working on Stargate, similar a storyline, episode or scene that stands out to yous equally something special?
Amanda: I loved working with Carmen Argenziano, who played my dad. We had an instant connection and I just adored that man. I'm and then deplorable that he's gone. We had a swell time whenever we worked together and it was just so familiar, like he felt like my dad, y'all know? It was like that from the beginning, so I loved anything to do with the Jacob storyline.
I loved working with JR Bourne, [who played] Martouf. The Casandra storyline with Teryl [Rothery] and I sort of raising this girl. And anything with Don Davis. Don Davis was such a hoot. I have so many memories of sitting in that briefing room laughing like an idiot because of something Don said. Then when Beau Bridges joined, my God, we had Fellow Bridges on our show for crying out loud. Like what? Crazy! And I was so in awe of him and and so nervous to work with him, but he was so lovely so fun. And there'southward many outtakes of us just laughing in the briefing room.
I don't tell a lie. When I say this, we laughed every unmarried mean solar day. Every day. There was something that fabricated us laugh, no matter how tired we were, or wet or common cold or whatever. There was e'er something that made us laugh. That is a massive gift.
Directing the action
Space.com: For the terminal few years, you've mainly been behind the camera rather than in front end of information technology. Have you been enjoying directing and how do the challenges of directing compare to acting?
Amanda: I absolutely love information technology. Practice I miss interim? Very much, but I do love being backside the photographic camera. I dearest being function of the creative squad. I love the camaraderie of existence on the floor all the time with the crew and the collaboration that happens when y'all're a director.
There'south something about walking onto a set where you don't know anybody and having to win them over. You go well-nigh a half hr window. Same when yous're in prep as the commencement meeting informs everything. I did a show in New York and I'd never worked in New York earlier and so I didn't know whatever of the people. I knew Martin Gero, but he wasn't there, so I was walking in bullheaded on Blindspot. And I was and then scared, but that fear gives me a lot of adrenaline. It's just plugging into the matrix of a different testify every time and plugging into that free energy.
I think because I'm an player, I play dissimilar parts of myself, depending on what's needed. So at that place's a lot of acting involved in my directing. I hope that doesn't audio bad, simply there's a lot of just reading the situation and knowing what it needs from me.
For the last two years, I've been the producing managing director on a show called Motherland: Fort Salem. That's a whole different animate being where you're really deeply embedded in the production: there all the time, hiring the directors, making sure the crew is okay, making sure the casts are okay. It's a big responsibility and information technology was a fresh challenge for me. That was exciting, just I feel twitchy after doing the second AI read. I was twitchy to get back into acting in some class.
Infinite.com: If there was a future Stargate project, would that exist something yous would want to get involved with?
Amanda: Absolutely. And it's funny, because when it finished, I was like "Y'all can't go backwards. It's done." But [...] in doing those readings, the final two AIs, information technology made me realize how much I still dear that grapheme, and I still love the concept of the bear witness, and I nonetheless love my beau actors. Information technology was just lovely. Information technology felt like going home. There peradventure was a period of time where I was like, "I'm done, let's move on people." Now there'southward another part of me that's very much similar, "yeah, I would admittedly." But I would make sure that I was allowed to direct them too.
I think that maybe we all would. I haven't actually asked that question of my fellow actors, simply I think there's a part of u.s.a. all that would in some way. I hateful, it would have to be a different iteration of the show, and peradventure we'd just be ancillary characters that float in and out every now and over again, but absolutely.
Laurence: Or perchance you'd be in charge.
Amanda: In charge of the whole thing.
Laurence: President Carter has a prissy ring to it.
Amanda: It really does. Golly, Laurence.
Laurence: Hire me as a writer, I'll do it.
Infinite.com: Nosotros can't rent yous, nosotros've got the AI you congenital.
Laurence: Oh dang. Format C:
Infinite.com: Amanda, having worked as a managing director on so many other shows, are there any actors yous've worked with or upcoming talents that you call up would be ideal for a new Stargate prove?
Amanda: Oh, yeah, in that location's quite a few. I'1000 afraid to say considering then the actors whose names I don't mention would be like "what about us?" But there's an extra by the proper name of Demetria McKinney who'southward at present doing Winchester which is the prequel to Supernatural. She was on Motherland [...] and Lyne Renée, who played our General Alder on Motherland, are both just incredible talents.
I honey Kiernan Shipka, who's a huge star. I worked with her on Sabrina and I have never worked with a number one who was that committed, and that gracious. And Eric McCormack on Travelers – simply super professional and wonderful. I would work with her, I'd work with Eric, and I'd work with any of the cast from Travelers once more. They were all amazing.
Don't send a machine to do a person'southward chore (or vice versa)
Space.com: Brad, why are you running a program to assist an AI replace you? Aren't y'all worried almost the AI stealing your task?
Brad: Nope. Not in my lifetime. Is it incredible for what it is? Yes. Does it replace a human imagination? No. And if it ever does, the ramifications volition go far beyond screenwriting.
Space.com: Laurence, are you gunning for Brad'southward job?
Laurence: No, of course not, at least not in the AI sense. I wouldn't mind existence a writer and a producer, but I just don't have the skill fix for that. The idea here is, if you can create something that helps make people similar Brad more productive, if you can utilise technology to exist able to do that kind of thing – and not but writers and producers, any kind of creator – something that volition help them be more productive, aid stop writer'due south block, help spur ideas, etc.
I'm a coder primarily and at that place are tools out at that place if I want to build an app to do X, Y, or Z, there's a matter out at that place that tin can automate a lot of the grunt piece of work for me, and so I bring value by putting the detail, adding the leaves to the tree as it were, instead of me having to do everything [...] something similar that for the Tv industry, for the movie manufacture. [...] That'due south the eventual result of something like this as opposed to replacement.
The important thing is to retrieve well-nigh moving people up the value chain. A lot of times a negative skew on this can be it replaces jobs, only this is making the skills that you bring more valuable past removing some of the drudgery that you generally have to do.
Space.com: Have you been surprised past how effective the AI is?
Laurence: I think I've ever had the thought that the right application of AI models and techniques with AI models would have a neat outcome. Part of my motivation for doing this kind of thing is to go people beyond the hype cycle of AI. No disrespect meant to Brad, but the statement that he made was like, "hey, wouldn't information technology be great if you could get an AI, feed it hundreds of scripts, and it volition write a new script" is very much in the hype cycle. When nosotros tin bust through the hype cycle, so you can come across what this kind of thing can do, and, only equally importantly, what it can not do, and then real innovation can begin.
When you watch that showtime script reading, you probably saw that's when we started busting through the hype bike, falling into what we call the trough of disillusionment, which sounds like an Ori vacation army camp. Once nosotros're in at that place, and then [you lot realize] this is what you can do, this is what you can't do, this is fun, this is ridiculous.
The AI industry as a whole is still backside that peak of inflated expectations in the hype cycle, and projects like this help usa go through that. Then when non-technical people like actors or writers first thinking and ideating, in one case they understand that the technology is all about solutions for them, so we start changing the world. We offset edifice solutions for the people who volition really be using this, like the idea of a co-pilot for a writer, you know? I think this is a great way that we'd exist able to change the earth.
Infinite.com: Finally, we know you tin can't tell u.s.a. anything real here, but you also know nosotros take to ask. MGM has been picked up by Amazon, and in that location's been a lot of excitement around the thought of a new Stargate testify coming to Prime Video. Are yous actively pitching in that location? Is that something you think nosotros're probable to run into? You lot've already promised Marc (Evan Jackson) a spot on the cast, you can't let him down.
Brad: Ha! Well, I'll say this much: MGM called me to write a airplane pilot a few years agone for a very interested buyer, who specifically wanted me. I wrote something that was very new, yet grounded in the universe nosotros created over 17 seasons of shows called Stargate, including several familiar faces in recurring roles, ten years on. Just read it again the other day and I'1000 still proud of it.
And so the pandemic hit. And so much has changed in the earth since so, including all of the decision-makers, I can just wait and see along with everyone else what Amazon decides to do with their franchise.
But they'll do something. They'd be crazy not to. With or without me.
A huge give thanks you lot to Amanda, Brad, and Laurence for giving united states their time and chatting with united states of america about Stargate. If y'all want to check out the Stargate AI ii.0 screen read, it's going live over at The Companion on May 21st at 11am PDT, 2pm EDT, 7pm BST. You can either tune in for the initial event, or picket the whole readthrough at a later date.
You'll need to be subscribed to The Companion, just luckily they're running a promotion at the moment that gives you a three-month free trial. Nosotros'll definitely be tuning in, so we hope to see you over there.
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Source: https://www.space.com/stargate-ai-2-interview-with-amanda-tapping-brad-wright-laurence-moroney
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